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Ines Echevarria's Complete Thai Massage Course Notes
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Ines Echevarria
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August 10, 2016 - 7:40 pm
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MODULE 10

 It has happened that one of the persons I have practised on, had never had received a massage and she was a person that was all time controlling what was going on and it was impossible to get her relaxed. Chi machine, rocking movements was several times repeated. She came with pain on her back and neck and told me she needed a massage. Is there something else that can be done in this case ?

The rest of the cases was OK to do the techniques shown in this module. There has been a shift in my mind and now I can see very clearly all the sequences and how they are done. I don't know what happened to me before to feel so confused. Work on legs (warm up and stretches) was a mixture of postures of hands, legs that I was feeling overwhelmed even if I am used to them!!!!! Now everything looks easy and nice.

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Shama Kern
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August 11, 2016 - 2:50 am
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About the 45 degree stretch: It's normal that the other hip comes up a bit unless the client is very flexible. If you try to hold it down, you intensify the stretch quite a bit. So just let the hip come up a bit, no problem. If it comes up too much, then you might take the stretch too far and cause discomfort for the client.

You can prevent the foot from sliding out of your groin by pulling back with the hand that's wrapped around the leg just above the knee.

There are certain clients who are impossible to relax. Their minds are running like mad mosquitos and they watch everything you do. Luckily there aren't many of those around, but if you have one, they are not fun to work with. If the person keeps coming back for more sessions, then you can gradually relax them. But if it's a one time affair, and you have one one of those hyper types who just can't let go at all, then you just have to accept that what we do works on most people, but not on every single one.

Putting such a person in the prone position can help, since then at least they can't watch what you are doing. You can also try to verbally get them to relax by telling them that they will get much more out of the session if they close their eyes and just let it be for a while.

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Ines Echevarria
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August 17, 2016 - 12:13 am
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MODULE 11

As when I first saw the video, I noticed some slight changes I reviewed videos from module 3 to 11 and I have some questions related to feet and legs I didn't ask before.

- Do you check how the hips are before starting the massage, or after working with feet ?

- Normally most people have weak haras, at least I feel my hara is not strong. So if as you recommend we have to be concentrated on it, is bendingof our body -a movement we often do in Thai massage- a perfect moment to activate it or to concentrate on it ?

- When you make circles with the legs while doing leg stretches, I see that the body of the girl on the video moves, but when I do that the client's body doesn't move so much. Am I doing something wrong?

-When I make the stretch that crosses one leg over the other I have dared to do the short terapist's version on everybody that consists on pressing the outer side of the thigh with my leg.

- It seems that you prefer not to use the warm ups from module 5 (hands) as you have used the forearms. I also prefer this as some clients have complained that thumbs were rather painful.

- Can we work first on one feet then in the other. Go back to warm up one leg and  then the other. And end up going back to the first leg in order to stretch it and then the other one?

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August 17, 2016 - 2:52 am
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"Do you check how the hips are before starting the massage, or after working with feet?"
I check them before.

"Normally most people have weak haras, at least I feel my hara is not strong. So if as you recommend we have to be concentrated on it, is bendingof our body -a movement we often do in Thai massage- a perfect moment to activate it or to concentrate on it?"
In the beginning it is easiest to concentrate on it when you are not moving your body much. After a while it will become second nature and you just do it automatically.

"When you make circles with the legs while doing leg stretches, I see that the body of the girl on the video moves, but when I do that the client's body doesn't move so much. Am I doing something wrong?"
Not necessarily. It depends on the weight and size of someone's body. If someone is quite heavy, their body might move less. Also the degree of flexibility can change how much the body moves. So not every client will look like my model's body when it comes to movement during this technique.
Another thing is how you do the circling. If you do it in a very fluid style, it will be almost like a rocking sensation. If you don't do it in this fluid way, then the client's body will not move much.

"It seems that you prefer not to use the warm ups from module 5 (hands) as you have used the forearms. I also prefer this as some clients have complained that thumbs were rather painful."
Whenever possible I try to use other body parts besides hands and thumbs. That's just to preserve my hands.  Many therapists report that after many years their hands and wrists are starting to hurt or wear out. In Thai Massage this can  be avoided by using other body parts.

"Can we work first on one foot and then on the other. Go back to warm up one leg and  then the other. And end up going back to the first leg in order to stretch it and then the other one?"
Yes, some therapists work like that. There are really no hard and fast rules how to set up the sequence. I show the way how I like to do it, but there is nothing wrong with doing the sequence differently.

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Ines Echevarria
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August 20, 2016 - 9:26 pm
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MODULE 12

As modules are arriving I get much more confident, and I am starting to enjoy much more Thai massage. 

 

- I have had problems to fix my lower legs to the thighs, as I am unable to see, due to your trousers where you place them. Is the right place along the external side of the client's legs or inside a bit  towards the middle of them?

- A person told me that she couldn't have imagine herself doing the last stretch. She was very pleasantly surprised and this gave her another perception of herself.

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August 20, 2016 - 9:57 pm
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The client's thigh cannot be parallel to your lower leg. It will naturally cross your lower leg at a little bit of an angle since the client's foot is outside of your hip. Keep your feet as close as possible to the client's body. You will feel the right position which works best for blocking the client's thigh.

It all depends on the size of your legs and the size of the client's legs, so that's why there is no exact rule where the legs go. It's a matter of experimenting with a few different bodies until you can just feel what the ideal position is.

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August 20, 2016 - 9:57 pm
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MODULE 13

Nobody has complained of  pain on the joint, so far. Instead many have had felt pain, for their surprise, on the inner side of the thigh, on a line that goes down to the knee along the tendon.I massage this doing small circles with my fingers.

What do you do if it happens that  someone comes with  a pain of those so called trigger points or a chronic pain?

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August 20, 2016 - 10:03 pm
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When someone has pain in certain areas, I use mostly motion movements like rocking, circling, wiggling, to loosen it up. After that you can use slightly stronger movements like rolling up with the heels of your hands. I generally avoid pressing on painful spots directly in a linear way until it is all relaxed and warmed up. 

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Ines Echevarria
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August 24, 2016 - 10:29 pm
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MODULE 14

Very pleasant movements for the receivers. Most of them prefer the rocking to the elephant walk in the first one. 

I don´t have very flexible hips or legs so I have problems to do the transitions without stopping the massage and even to do the last technique sat on the floor, I have had problems with a big person. I couldn´t reach with my hands his body.

I have to work in order to make my legs, knees and hips more flexible in order to move my body in a more easy way.EmbarassedSmile

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August 25, 2016 - 12:55 am
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That will definitely help! Smile

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August 28, 2016 - 2:31 pm
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MODULE 15

Again an issue related to size... a big belly. I solved the problem moving the hand drawing a bigger circle around the belly very very slowly. Is this correct ? Is there another way of doing it ?

Do we have to press deeper in order to massage the orgarns?

Does it make any change which hand is up or down? Is it just a matter of ergonomics ?

As for the upper area of the body, I find it very interesting what you teach us as I have found many people,both male and female, for which it is painful, some times they feel an unbearable pain, to be touched in their sternon and shoulders. (There is so much emotional pain in them, I guess !!!)

I love what you say about the hands, hands that become eyes.. about engaging breathing, hara in the movements we do.

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August 28, 2016 - 3:25 pm
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MODULE 16

 

In the first pull-push movement, a client with a very stiff neck kept on lifting his head up out of the mat. I tried to do a very small lift movement but it seemed not to work, that is, or the head lifts out of the mat, much less but it keeps following the shoulders movement or there is no movement at all, shoulders and head hardly separates of the mat.

 

Is there any chance of arm separating from the shoulder. I have heart that it has happened in some massages when working with shoulders.

In spite of what I have mentioned before, this module has been the one with best feed back reports from those with whom I practise the module. The efects went on for long time.

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August 29, 2016 - 12:27 am
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"Do we have to press deeper in order to massage the organs?"
Ultimately yes, but you have to approach it like peeling an onion - layer by layer. You have to start very gently and then work your way deeper. I cover this much more in depth in my more specialized Abdominal Massage course. The Complete Thai Massage course just gives you a few techniques for the abdomen, but if you really want to work on the various organs, then you need to specialize. This goes beyond the scope of general full body Thai Massage.

"Does it make any change which hand is up or down? Is it just a matter of ergonomics?"
Yes, it is primarily a matter of ergonomics.

If someone has such a stiff neck that it is not possible for them to keep their head on the mat, then I would skip this techniques on this client and use different neck techniques to relax the neck and create more range of motion.

"Is there any chance of arm separating from the shoulder. I have heart that it has happened in some massages when working with shoulders."
The only time when there is a risk of pulling the arm out of the shoulder socket is if someone is really hyper mobile. You can generally tell, because with such people the knees and the elbows have the tendency to "hang through". The arms and legs, when extended, are not straight, but bent at an unnatural angle. On hyper mobile people you have to be very careful not to do any arm traction moves.

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September 3, 2016 - 10:21 pm
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MODULE 17

Beautiful work. I and my voluntiers have very much enjoyed it. Besides, hands are another important reflex area in the body.

As regards to arms, there is very little space between the inside line of the outer side of the arm and the outside line of the inner side of the arm and the other way round. Do you pay attention to this or it doesn't matter if we repeat the same line twice ?

I see you don't use the two thumbs confronted position when doing the lines as it is taught in another Thai Massage courses. Is this because we are just warming up the arms and not working with them as, in my opinion, it effects a greater presure ?or it is just for not damaging so much this part of the hand with this hard job?

Can we also work them with the bottom of the palm while doing the first technique ?

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September 3, 2016 - 11:19 pm
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MODULE 18

In my opinion the most important thing for the healing process of a person is that he must be relaxed, in fact most of the people I see in my massaje sessions are very rigid, strict with themselves or/and others.

They are always controlling everything. So, my questions is the following: As the nervous central system is on the head, eyes and neck are involved parts, even relaxing eyes all body relaxes.... would it be possible to start the massaje from the head? 

Yes,  if you are relaxed, the client will be relaxed, this is the mirror neurons job, but it doen't always work, specially if the client keeps on asking questions, talking... there is a person that doesn`t stop talking even if I don't follow the conversation. I allow this because it seems that they need doing this just for relaxing their inner presure and mind. Other times I suggest them to start to feel what happens in their body or their breathing.

Again problems with my knesize, my arms are short for broad shoulders and I tried to do the last technique kneeling, is this correct even if it not very elegant?

Squatting is a bit of a problem for me as I have to rise my foot  fingers in order to keep in balance and not to fall down backwards. I have been told that this is due to the shape of my hip so thank you for the second choice. Here isn't a major problem but it was while working with that I had to stop the movement in order to get balanced. I am working with my psoas muscle and streching my legs in order to improve this important issue in Thai masssage.

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September 3, 2016 - 11:24 pm
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You don't have to get really scientific about the location of the lines. First of all different schools have different interpretations as far as the number and location of the lines are concerned, and second if you just keep working the arm as shown in the video, you will hit those lines. Even if you totally disregard the lines, you will still do a great and effective arm massage. Sen line mastery can always come or improve later, so don't worry too much about it for now.

I don't like a lot of direct linear thumb pressure. It easily gets too hard for the thumbs and can lead to injury for the therapist. I know that for sure since I developed such an injury (thumb joint inflammation) in the early days of my Thai Massage career (took over a year to heal), and I know a bunch of Thai Massage therapists who burned out their thumbs with the traditional linear thumb pressing methods. That's why I teach a more therapist friendly method.

The first arm technique is done with the bottom or heel of the hand.

There are Thai Massage schools where they start with the head - well, at least one that I know of - but I prefer the traditional way of starting with the feet and ending with the head. This has always given me the best results, especially when I blend in some techniques from my Heavenly Head Massage course at the end. This is by far the best method to put people into a blissful trance state. You can't get this same result by ending with the feet.

If you do the figure eight technique with both knees on the mat, you will lose most of your leverage and you will strain your back really badly.

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September 4, 2016 - 5:14 pm
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Thank you for answering my crazy questions. They come out from my urge to"go deeper" into the healing process.

I was a promising humanistic phycotherapy therepist and I just quitted because I felt that theraphy only changes the surface mind patterns not reaching the rooth of human suffering.

And I would love so mjch that a massage could have the most healing effects.... May be I am dreamer, a fool,.. but at least I would like to do the best in the time I am touching a person. May be I should start by relaxing myselfSmile

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September 4, 2016 - 7:25 pm
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I CAN'T DOWNlLOAD MODULE 19. AS I PRESS THE RIGHT BOTTON OF MY MOUSE AND IT STARTS DOWNLOADING, THE PROCESS IS CANCELLED IN A FEW SECONDS. 

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Shama Kern
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September 5, 2016 - 12:36 am
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You can go very deep with Thai Massage. You will hear a lot more about that in this course and in the bonus courses.

There is nothing wrong with the link for module 19. I tested it and it works fine at my end. So it must be an issue with your browser. There are a couple of things you can do:

1. If you have another browser, try opening it in there. That might resolve it.
2. Clear the browser cache and restart the browser.

If these two things don't fix it, let me know and I will send you the link via email. Maybe that will resolve it. However in most cases it tends to be a browser issue or an internet connection issue. Try downloading it a day later, and maybe it will work perfectly. If that's the case, then the problem was with your internet connectivity.

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September 11, 2016 - 11:42 pm
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MODULE 19

Sometimes the flow of the techniques goes fast for me to practise with somebody but it is a great video as an overall view of the upper body work. Nevertheles it has been very useful for that and for I have got things I missed in the previous modules as the stomach sandwich technique where I hadn´t realized I have to put the hand under. Thank you for the "extras" of the shoulder rocking movements.

The last minutes are priceless. Working with the hara and breath together for that invisible ingredient that enpowers the healing  or balancing process of a body is GREAT great great.... Now is difficult to concentrate on it as my brain and attention goes to my hands and to all details we have to take into account in each technique but this will be my aim, to do everything with my hara, breathing together with all my body.

You have taught us many techniques, so my question is the following: How can we decide which technique to use in a massage ?  we ask the client what they want to be released of or where  they feel stiffness or pain,  but if they just want it to get relaxed ? In this case, will anyone be ok? Are there any techniques that could be considered a must or that are specially nice for this purpose (stress relief or for balancing the body's energies)

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